Why's it called "Good Friday" anyway? Torture and death of a prophet doesn't seem "good."

[NoodleyAppendage]

Just wondering. Didn't see a reason for the "Good Friday" label over at wikipedia. It would seem to me that a solemn name for the holiday would be more appropriate.

J

[Cleita]

1. Don't know for sure but a lot of English name terms get corrupted over

the centuries, so perhaps it was known as God or God's Friday and evolved by spelling error into Good Friday. In Spanish it's know as "el vierno santo" or holy Friday.

[Aristus]

2. Sounds plausible.

"Good-bye" started out as a contraction of "Godbye" or "God be with you."

[Richard D]

3. My understanding . . .

. . . and I'm not a Christian, is that it's good because that's the day he "died for your sins". So it's good for the sheep but not for the Sheppard.

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Oregone]

10. I thought it was the day his Daddy threw him to the wolves

Ya know, forsaken him

[Morning Dew]

15. DU translation:

Threw him under the bus.

:hi:

[gmoney]

4. He owes his career to torture and death

If he'd not been persecuted, nobody would know who he is today.

Sort of like Conan O'Brien.

[Canuckistanian]

5. "Good Friday" is like "Paradoxes for Dummies"

We're all supposed to see the ultimate results, not the obvious bad news of our Lord and Saviour dying a humiliating death.

That's why Easter Sunday follows a mere 48 hours later. You can't stretch the point TOO far.

[mrs_p]

7. from the catholic encyclopedia

"Good Friday, called Feria VI in Parasceve in the Roman Missal, he hagia kai megale paraskeue (the Holy and Great Friday) in the Greek Liturgy, Holy Friday in Romance Languages, Charfreitag (Sorrowful Friday) in German, is the English designation of Friday in Holy Week — that is, the Friday on which the Church keeps the anniversary of the Crucifixion of Jesus Christ."

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/06643a.htm

[Posteritatis]

16. Good catch on the various other national terms

It depresses me a bit that yours is pretty much the only useful response in the thread, but I can't say I'm surprised at the others.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

8. Lots of old terms have been corrupted.

God to Good Friday, as here.

Bloody comes from "By our Lady" meaning Mary.

Maybe we should start using archaic exclamations like "Od's Bodikins!" or some such.

That means "God's bodikins". A bodkin is like a big darning needle. Like you'd mend socks with or whatever. Gee, I didn't know that God wore socks, much less that he fixed his own.....:rofl:

Sometimes I know so much useless information that I amuse myself TOO MUCH..... :D

[underseasurveyor]

9. Perhaps they dropped the word "Riddance"

:shrug:

Accidentally or on purpose, I dunno:evilgrin:

[ZombieHorde]

34. Ha! Awesome. nt

[omega minimo]

38. that's incredibly hateful

[ashling]

11. This seems appropriate here

it is a sermon which I have posted elsewhere a couple of times. It is titled No More Crosses and calls to Christians to honor Jesus' Life, not his Death:



I am posting more than 4 paragraphs, but not nearly all of it.
it is a sermon - it was meant to be shared - to be repeated - to be lived

http://networkedblogs.com/p30397811

####

Why are we so obsessed with this man's death?

Dying was his reason for living.

Really? The belief that Jesus died for us or died for our sins or died to save us has been Christianity's theological centerpiece. His death and resurrection are two parts of this mythology.

That mythology has little to do with the historical person of Jesus.

####


Jesus had a life before he died. The things he did and the things he said were provocative enough to put him on the wrong side of the authorities. From the things people remembered that he did and said, he was critical of the authorities. He was critical of the religious authorities and of the political authorities. That is what got him killed.

He challenged systems of authority that took advantage of widows, of the poor, and of the outcast. He created a movement. And it was threatening enough that those in power felt the need to stop him. Perhaps to make of him an example. That is what got him killed.

There were many people tortured and killed on Roman crosses. Jesus was one of many.

####

He was on the side of people who were oppressed by the economic policies of the temple. That is what got him killed. He was on the side of people considered unclean and sinners by the religious.

He is remembered for telling parables and stories that upset people. He used a phrase "kingdom of God." That phrase means little to us because we have tamed it. Most folks thanks to the theologians think it is another phrase for heaven, a place the true believers go when they die.

It is likely that it was a political statement. As opposed to the kingdom of Caesar, this is what the kingdom of God is like. It wasn't just a fantasy, a story. It was a movement. This the kingdom to live for, to work for, perhaps even to die for. It is a kingdom of justice and compassion. In this kingdom, in this political economy the hungry are filled with good things. Now let's make it so.

Jesus was about making changes in this world. That is what got him killed.

He talked about compassion. He talked about moving beyond ethnic boundaries and divisions. He talked about forgiveness. Not something you go to the priest for or even to God for, but your neighbor. That is the one we hurt. That is the one from whom we need forgiveness. We get it as we give it. He worked to bring people together: Samaritan and Jew, Greek and Roman. He practiced an open table, rich and poor, male and female. He challenged unjust boundaries and rules. That is what got him killed.

Dying was not his reason for living.

Living was his reason for dying.

For life, he died. For integrity, he died. For compassion, he died. For justice, he died. For change, he died.

He was in the way. He was in the way of progress. He was in the way of Rome. He was in the way of the religious authorities who had sold out their people to Rome. He was killed as were many just like him.

The only difference is that while those others are unknown to us, we know some of Jesus' story. We know about what he lived for.

I think it is a sham and a shame that the religious establishment distorted his story. They took his story and turned into a caricature.

######

That story is supposedly better than what really happened?

And the crazy thing is that we just take it. We accept it.

Hardly anyone raises an objection. No one says,

"Wait a second! Jesus had to die this bloody torturous death because I am so bad? Even though I wasn't even born when he died?"

It is actually rather sick. Seriously. It is pathological theology. We simply take it.

#####


Jesus' life was fast. Like Martin Luther King, they both died before reaching forty. But their lives burned with passion and fire. They burned out for compassion and justice.

Apparently, they believed that it is better to have burned out than never to have burned at all.

Whenever any of us stands up for those who are abused or put down or who suffer injustice from bullies big and small, we practice true religion.

No need for a lot of theological hocus pocus.

Do justice.
Love kindness.
Walk humbly.

Amen.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

13. they need to forget the blood, guts and torture. It's a death cult.

Ashling you are right.

Take out the cultural baggage and the literalism.

Reduce it to "love thy neighbor" and "do good while you can".

[ashling]

14. He calls it "a pathological theology"

"Whenever any of us stands up for those who are abused or put down or who suffer injustice from bullies big and small, we practice true religion."

[defendandprotect]

22. .... but you can't scare people with Jesus's life .... you need the torture and the cross--!!!

Where would male-supremacist religion be without torture and a cross!!???

:evilgrin:

[provis99]

12. because Good Friday, like evey other "Christian" holiday, was stolen from Pagans.

Good Friday was a fasting day celebrated 100 years before Jesus was supposedly born. It was the Feast of Tammuz, a Babylonian goddess, and celebrated the end of hard times in winter, with a renewal of the community that comes with Spring. Good Friday refers simply to the end of the fasting season, and having a good feast day.

Hot cross buns, traditional for Easter, are also pagan.

The start of the Lent season, Ash Wednesday, is also pagan.

Christianity is largely a fraud grafted onto a pagan framework.

[frustrated_lefty]

17. I keep waiting for the pagan gods to smite down the heretics...

[dmallind]

20. And this one, in English, didn't even hide the fact for once

Eostre being a goddess of various northern European tribes.

[defendandprotect]

23. My understanding is they couldn't hide all of it -- they were humoring the pagans . . . to get what

they wanted -- well, sometimes not humoring them since a lot of violence

was involved in overturning the gods/goddesses in order to arrive at the

one-all male-violent god!

Everything becomes violent with this changeover to patriarchy!

[KatyMan]

28. "Christianity is largely a fraud grafted onto a pagan framework"

Let's not forget paganism is part of the same fraud...

[old mark]

18. I think EVERY Friday is "Good Friday" if you don't

work the weekend....


mark

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dmallind]

21. Now let's be fair

There are far easier targets than the name of a celebration if that were the intent. Happy Eostre!

[Gaedel]

27. Without passing judgment

Without passing judgment on the "articles of faith" of any other person's choice of religion, many of the pagan holidays and traditions were co-opted into Christianity, particularly in the conversion of northern Europe.

Eostre/Ostara was a pagan goddess worshiped after the first full moon after the vernal equinox (Easter Sunday being the first Sunday after the first full moon). Eostre/Ostara was a Germanic goddess of the spring and fertility. Her sacred animal/familiar was the hare (in German, the Osterhaas). This morphed into the Easter Bunny. As a fertility symbol, colored and decorated eggs were placed on her altar asking for fertility in crops and livestock.

The Christian missionaries to the Germans/Norse/Anglo-Saxons despaired of getting the people to stop their traditional seasonal celebrations, so they blended them into the church calender.

[defendandprotect]

24. Spring Equinox is what it's all about -- renewal -- fertility -- life-affirming . . .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spring_equinox_in_Teotihuac%C3%A1n



And the stories and truths are told every Spring because it's a good reminder of

Nature and our dependency upon her.

And, because many here don't know about the old religions based on Nature!


It's also another opportunity to wake up Christian members who may still be

supporting male-supremacist religion. Nothing like some history/truth to wake people up!

[NoodleyAppendage]

26. Look do you know why it's called "Good" Friday or not? Or, are you characteristically unquestioning

For some curiosity is not a dirty word.

[muriel_volestrangler]

29. There's a decent explanation in reply #7

but it's true not much attention has been paid to it. If the Catholic Encyclopedia isn't good (heh) enough for you, try the OED:

good, a., adv., and n.
8. a. Pious, devout; worthy of approbation from the religious point of view.
b. of books, etc.: Tending to spiritual edification. the good book: spec. the Bible.
c. of a day or season observed as holy by the church. good tide: (a) Christmas; (b) Shrove Tuesday. Cf. GOOD FRIDAY.

Good Friday
(See GOOD a. 8c.)

The Friday before Easter-day, observed as the anniversary of the death of Christ.

[omega minimo]

39. and for some

"feigned ignorance" is appropriate

[defendandprotect]

25. Remember those days of torture quite well from my school days . . .

season after season -- a violent "god."

Stations of the Cross --

Wondering why your parents have thrown you to these wolves!

[Love Bug]

30. What I've never understood about Good Friday

Wasn't Jesus supposed to have been dead three days before his resurrection? But there aren't three days between Friday and Sunday. Shouldn't it be "Good Wednesday"?

I'm not being a smart ass. I seriously want to know.

[LanternWaste]

31. Usage derives from "Great" or "Holy" Friday

Usage is most likely a derivative of "Great" or "Holy" Friday from the Latin Vulgate.
(Cheslyn Jones, The Study of Liturgy)


Some say it is from "God's Friday" (Gottes Freitag) Others maintain that it is from the German 'Gute Freitag', and not specially English. Some also maintain that the word 'good' is a derivative of the Anglo-Saxon word 'long', of which the day is also referred to (i.e., Long Friday)

[Toasterlad]

32. Wouldn't It Be Ironic If The Sign Over the Cross - Instead of Saying "INRI" - Said "TGIF"?

Someone needs to photoshop that.

[ChadwickHenryWard]

33. It could not possibly have ever said that.

"INRI" stands for the Latin "Iesus Nazarenus Rex Iudaeorum;" "Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews." But the Romans living in the Eastern part of the Empire spoke Greek, not Latin. The area had already been under Greek influence for hundreds of years, and since any important Roman already spoke Greek anyway, it was just simpler to leave it that way. Not even the Roman soldiers would have spoken it - Pilate, and maybe Herod, are the only two in the whole story who would have had any working knowledge of Latin. (Or, you know, anybody else who had spent a significant amount of time in the Western part of the Empire.) In other words, "TGIF" is just as likely to have appeared as "INRI."

[Toasterlad]

35. Or, As Is More Likely, There Was NO Sign, As There Was No Crucifixion

And no Jesus. But it's fun to speculate.

[ChadwickHenryWard]

36. I happen to know that becuase my friend's dad attended seminary, years and years ago.

When we were in high school, and The Passion of The Christ came out, my buddy's dad complained that it shouldn't have been in Latin because nobody there spoke it at the time. I often forget when sharing my true opinion of religion to him that his father was once a minister and his mother has the devoutness shown by the recently converted (Greek Orthodox, of all things.) He gets offended sometimes. I remember he used to get mad at my fascination at the time with the physical impossibility of many of the stories in the bible, particularly the piles and piles of reasons why the Noahic flood could never have happened. Anyway, that movie was focus-grouped into unrecognizability. Gibson's original script was a far cry from what it ended up being. He held an endless string of focus groups during its production to ensure the movie would show maximum profitability. So much for his vaunted "relgious vision."

And I don't put too much thought into whether or not there was an actual, historical Jesus. I don't ever stop to wonder whether or not stories about Thor or Hercules were ever based on a real man, becuase I think it's just silly. Same with Jesus.

[Toasterlad]

37. I'm With You.

[Silent3]

40. Damn, talk about taking all the fun...

...out of the Latin grammar lesson in "Life of Brian". They need to translate it into Greek now. ;)



Brian is writing a slogan on a wall, oblivious to the Roman patrol approaching from behind. The slogan is "ROMANES EUNT DOMUS".

Centurion: What's this then? "ROMANES EUNT DOMUS"? "People called Romanes they go the house?"
Brian: It... it says "Romans go home".
Centurion: No it doesn't. What's Latin for "Roman"?

Brian hesitates

Centurion: Come on, come on!
Brian: (uncertain) "ROMANUS".
Centurion: Goes like?
Brian: "-ANUS".
Centurion: Vocative plural of "-ANUS" is?
Brian: "-ANI".
Centurion: (takes paintbrush from Brian and paints over) "RO-MA-NI". "EUNT"? What is "EUNT"?
Brian: "Go".
Centurion: Conjugate the verb "to go"!
Brian: "IRE"; "EO", "IS", "IT", "IMUS", "ITIS", "EUNT".
Centurion: So "EUNT" is ...?
Brian: Third person plural present indicative, "they go".
Centurion: But "Romans, go home!" is an order, so you must use the ...?

He lifts Brian by his short hairs

Brian: The ... imperative.
Centurion: Which is?
Brian: Um, oh, oh, "I", "I"!
Centurion: How many Romans? (pulls harder)
Brian: Plural, plural! "ITE".

Centurion strikes over "EUNT" and paints "ITE" on the wall

Centurion: "I-TE". "DOMUS"? Nominative? "Go home", this is motion towards, isn't it, boy?
Brian: (very anxious) Dative?

Centurion draws his sword and holds it to Brian's throat

Brian: Ahh! No, ablative, ablative, sir. No, the, accusative, accusative, ah, "DOMUM", sir, "AD DOMUM"!
Centurion: Except that "DOMUS" takes the ...?
Brian: ...the locative, sir!
Centurion: Which is?
Brian: "DOMUM".
Centurion: (satisfied) "DOMUM"...

He strikes out "DOMUS" and writes "DOMUM"

Centurian: ..."-MUM". Understand?

Brian: Yes sir.

(Slogan now reads, "ROMANI ITE DOMUM")

Centurion: Now write it down a hundred times.
Brian: Yes sir, thank you sir, hail Caesar, sir.
Centurion: (saluting) Hail Caesar. If it's not done by sunrise, I'll cut your balls off.
Brian: (very relieved) Oh thank you sir, thank you sir, hail Caesar and everything, sir!

[ChadwickHenryWard]

42. That is easily one of the greatest comedy bits of all time.

John Cleese notes that it is unfortunately lost on most Americans, having never had a teacher like that. It's apparently a very common occurrance at British boarding schools. But we can still appreciate the total inapropriateness of the centurion giving him the grammer lesson, instead of taking him in for vandalism. Actually, as I understand it, grafitti was not really a crime. In Rome itself it was very common, if one was going out, to pick up some chalk and scribble "Going down to the river to do laundry" or whatever on the wall. If somebody came looking for you, they'd usually find the message somewhere in your neighborhood and then know where to find you. Pompeii stills has all sorts of boring and banal things nobody cares about scribbled on the walls, making it like an early version of Twitter.

[muriel_volestrangler]

43. Oh yes, it's very typical, especially for a Latin teacher

Most of mine were highly sarcastic at times. And a typical punishment was indeed to write out things in Latin time ofter time - 'principal parts' ('fero, ferre, tuli, latum'; 'sequor, sequi, secutus sum' and so on).

[Lydia Leftcoast]

41. "Good Friday" is a folk etymology from "God's Friday"

As someone up-thread noted, "Good-bye" is a contraction of "God be with ye."

[muriel_volestrangler]

44. No, it's not (the derivation of 'Good Friday', that is)

see #29. That is the correct derivation of 'goodbye', however.