Kerry (with McCain!) on Meet the Press Sunday

[MBS]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032608/

The latest unemployment numbers show signs of life for the economy but after the markets take a hit this week, questions are being raised about a return of the recession. Plus, the aftermath of the debt deal: Did lawmakers simply “kick the can down the road” on the tough choices? Will they be able to agree to a second round of mandatory spending reductions before drastic budget cuts to defense and entitlements automatically take effect? Or will it be business as usual in Washington? Joining us for both sides of the debate, key voices in the Senate and one-time Presidential nominees for their respective parties, John Kerry (D-MA) and John McCain (R-AZ)

Rachel Maddow will be on the roundtable. .
sounds like appointment TV to me!:popcorn:

[Mass]

1. He will be doing that the day after the PanMass race. Unbelievable

http://www.telegram.com/article/20110806/NEWS/108069966/0/business

http://www.telegram.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Site=WT&Date=20110806&Category=NEWS&ArtNo=108069966&Ref=AR&MaxW=740

[MBS]

3. Very humid, today, too.. not the most comfortable weather for a

bike ride..

[Inuca]

2. Big thanks for the heads up

I don't always follow the Sunday shows, especially recently, so knowing this in advance makes a BIG difference.

[YvonneCa]

4. Appointment TV...

...I like that. :hi:

[wisteria]

5. Thank you so much for the information-you know I will be watching.n/t

[Mass]

6. Great interview. Too bad he was followed by McCain. Yuck. I left the room.

One quibble, once again. If you say Social Security and Medicare are part of the deficit, say that you will not cut benefits. I listened to Dean this morning on FTN, and he was great on that. I wished other Dems did the same thing.

[MBS]

7. McCain really is a jerk.

He was in his shameless 2008 campaign mode. Disgusting.

[ObamaKerryDem]

8. He was great!

I LOVED the new term he coined "The Tea Party Downgrade"-right on! :thumbsup:

I agree on being more specific regarding the Big Three but JK has been pretty specific and consistent on this all along, I think.

Turned it off on McCain too-sounded like sour grapes to me! Looks like Boss Limbaugh gave him a talking to after his "Hobbit" Senate floor speech..

[Mass]

9. I agree he is consistent, but they need to say that each time, including Obama.

Each time they will not say it, they give ammunition to the GOP. Sad, but true and they cannot count on the media to say this is not what they meant. I watch the round table after McCain and frankly, David Gregory was just another RWer siding with Greenspan and Castellanos, not an objective host, and neither was Schieffer.

[Luftmensch067]

11. I actually thought Gregory held the Republicans to account a few times!

I was shocked and impressed. Perhaps not enough, but I've come to expect so little that any shred of allegiance to fact from the media gets cheers from me. I know I loved the way he called McCain on his BS (and I loved that at one point McCain had to look down to check his written talking points! Don't see JK having to consult a script!)

[MBS]

10. reported (with video clip) on Talking Points Memo

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/08/kerry-slams-tea-party-downgrade.php?ref=fpb

[MBS]

13. this is now the "headline story" on TPM.

big photo, too. . with glasses : ).

[wisteria]

12. I agree with everyone here-JK gave a wonderful and informative interview-

and McCain-well, he was a waste to watch-he seems afraid to say anything more about the Tea Party ignorance. And, all his other remarks were the same Repub talking points I have heard over and over again...Pres. Obama didn't have a plan...Pres. Obama didn't lead...blah,blah,blah.

[YvonneCa]

14. The Senator...Kerry, of course...

...was excellent. (McCain made me ill.) I thought he did a beautiful job of linking the downgrade to the Tea Party shenanigans. Rachel Maddow also was good at that. She was the perfect follow-up to the case Kerry had made earlier.

I have to tell you...last night, my local news did a short piece on the downgrade. Guess who they interviewed about it...WITH VIDEO...from the Pan Mass race? :7

I think things are getting better, guys. I know that seems out of sync with the news of the day, but if Senator Kerry is on LA news being questioned about the economy and the downgrade...on his bicycle :) ...something is changing. For the better. I think it will take time and a LOT of work, but I am very hopeful.

You know what they say..."It's always darkest just before the dawn." :hi:

[MBS]

15. Excellent! Thanks for this. n/t

[politicasista]

17. Sounds like he did good, but why is he getting blamed

for "creating" this mess with McCain by some (not all) supporters of the President? :shrug:

The Senator is one of Obama's best allies and he should not have to be berated by people that like Obama. He is trying to get us out of this mess as well.


:hi:

[YvonneCa]

18. I agree. All I can say is...

...people who blame Kerry aren't the sharpest tools in the toolbox. ;) They seem to be the type that 'jump on the bandwagon' without knowing who's driving or where it's going.

[politicasista]

19. Makes sense

Hope you and everyone is doing well. :hi:

[YvonneCa]

20. Thanks...

...I will be done with radiation treatments on Friday. And I am doing GREAT...so lucky. :hi:

[politicasista]

21. That is good news

Thanks for the positive reply. That said, hope Momma T is doing well in her BC fight. :hi: :grouphug:

[YvonneCa]

25. I hope so, too. She is an inspiration...

...to all of us, in so many ways. :)

[politicasista]

29. +100 n/t

[karynnj]

23. Great to hear! nt

[YvonneCa]

27. Thank you...

...karynnj. All the positive support is what I KNOW makes the difference. MAMMOGRAMS, everyone! :7

[Mass]

24. Great news...

[YvonneCa]

26. Thanks, Mass. I hope you are doing...

...well, too. :hi:

[karynnj]

22. I suspect it is because those supporters of the President are upset that he has

taken a lot of flack - and they are blaming Congress and fail to discriminate between the members. They are trying to deflect any blame from Obama. What I have seen (earlier in the week as I have not read much news since Friday is that much of the left has really criticized Obama's negotiations and the deal, which is awful.

In fairness, no one knows if ANYONE could have gotten a better deal - just that this one really stinks. Kerry has said he dislikes the deal, but the US defaulting was unthinkable. (I suspect the Republicans would have scored a bigger victory had that happened. They are correct in saying there is enough money coming in just to pay the interest on the debt, but that means the President choosing who does not get paid - and all answers are wrong. (ie Why does he hate old people, military people, or federal workers, who just do their job? remember the painful sad stories on the FAA people?) I suspect that if there were no deal, there would be low chances of re-election and (more important) it woul.d have been devastating to the economy.

Not only would there have been all the uncertainty problems, the US would suddenly have really implemented an immediate austerity program - essentially operating at a level commensurate with no deficit (ie living off just the revenue coming in as they could not add $1 to debt. This would, in addition to the pain and the disgrace of not paying for things already authorized and contracted for, would completely destroy the economy - far worse than the deal.

I suspect that it may be many years before we have a complete answer on why Obama did not use the 14th amendment. It could have been that the SC could have stopped it immediately or it could have been that it would have made the upcoming budget debate with the Republicans horrific. The only bad answer is if was done for political reasons for the President alone.

[YvonneCa]

28. This is a great post, karynnj. I think many of us are struggling with the same...

...issues you addressed here:

"I suspect it is because those supporters of the President are upset that he has taken a lot of flack - and they are blaming Congress and fail to discriminate between the members."

I don't think most people follow Congress closely enough to discriminate between members...or parties. Then they fall prey to GOP spin that is anti-government in general. That is probably true of many who voted Democratic in 2008...who only relied on the image painted of him during the election.

"In fairness, no one knows if ANYONE could have gotten a better deal - just that this one really stinks. Kerry has said he dislikes the deal, but the US defaulting was unthinkable. (I suspect the Republicans would have scored a bigger victory had that happened. They are correct in saying there is enough money coming in just to pay the interest on the debt, but that means the President choosing who does not get paid - and all answers are wrong. (ie Why does he hate old people, military people, or federal workers, who just do their job? remember the painful sad stories on the FAA people?) I suspect that if there were no deal, there would be low chances of re-election and (more important) it would have been devastating to the economy.

Not only would there have been all the uncertainty problems, the US would suddenly have really implemented an immediate austerity program - essentially operating at a level commensurate with no deficit (ie living off just the revenue coming in as they could not add $1 to debt. This would, in addition to the pain and the disgrace of not paying for things already authorized and contracted for, would completely destroy the economy - far worse than the deal."

Knowing that Obama, Biden and several VERY CAPABLE negotiators worked on this deal, I believe they got the best possible one, given the Tea Party's stance. Default was NOT an option, IMO. I am sure some would not agree with me on this. :) There is also a group of people (probably Dems and Repubs) who won't allow ANY change to SS, Medicare, etc...even modest adjustments over time. I think most Americans are more reasonable than that.

"I suspect that it may be many years before we have a complete answer on why Obama did not use the 14th amendment. It could have been that the SC could have stopped it immediately or it could have been that it would have made the upcoming budget debate with the Republicans horrific. The only bad answer is if was done for political reasons for the President alone."

I originally thought he should use the 14th Amendment, too. I liked when Bill Clinton suggested it...it provided space for that decision, if necessary. But I think it could have been a problem...for both political and practical reasons. GOP would have said it was un-constitutional and started impeachment...right before 2012. So politically, that's bad. BUT the other downside would be the distraction it would be from critical issues of the day that we face and need to debate...climate change, our future economy, fixing our governmental institutions, etc. For me, THAT is a reason not to do it. I'd like to think Obama saw that, too. :hi:

[politicasista]

31. Great thoughts

from the both of you.

It is not like Kerry helped leave a mess for Obama to clean up and decided to work against O/Biden, so why he is getting lumped in with McCain? (your first point clears that up. :)) He has been very statesmanlike with the WH; more than others in his party and 100 times more than the McCain and the GOP.

Another factor could be frustration at daily, blatant disrespect towards Obama, and the sentiment that his party has been silent on that issue (or have they?) With the elder lions and tigers passing on, the dysfunctional Senate has not helped much either.

Would have been interesting to see him use the 14th Amendment, but as you both have said, it would could have been a practical, political problem.


Just another reminder to leave the pol blogs and social networks alone on Sundays. They are :silly:.

[Mass]

32. And some people are just stupid and do not know what they talk about. (not you, those you quote)

The vast majority of democrats have applauded Kerry. If anything, some have wished Obama was more like Kerry (which is problematic in its own right because there are thing you can say as a surrogate than the president cannot say)

This said, what you say is problematic in its own right because the House and the Senate (democrats at least) have been ridiculously supportive of Obama. They are not there to accept everything that the president thinks is right. And frankly, Pelosi and Reid have had to work with things Obama had decided unilaterally and they really did not like. So dont blame the democratic House and Senate for this.

[politicasista]

34. Not blaming anyone

but PO's supporters out there in the social land are (Kerry/McCain unfortunately are in the mix). It is not like Kerry was going to buddy up with McCain and hang Obama out to dry. Agree that Democrats have been supportive of Obama and that is appreciated. However, there is an elephant in the room that should not be overlooked. :shrug:


Sorry, I entered this thread everyone. You all got this.


Hope you are doing well. Peace. :hi:

[Mass]

35. I think the word "some" once again is important...

Most of PO's supporters did not blame Obama. May be some who have no idea how politics work do, but why should I care?

BTW, all criticisms of PO are not racist (obviously, there are people who are racist, including among Dems). Some people are genuinely distraught and the poor communication skills Democrats in general and PO in particular show do not help. It is tiresome to hear PO laud GOPers and pretty much ignore Dems or spend his time praise Reagan. Some of us are actually Democrats and would hope that the president would promote Democratic/Progressive ideas, such as reforming Medicare does not involve CUTTING benefits.

[politicasista]

39. Agree with this

In fact, there is always room for improvement at communication among the WH and Democrats, and do not like him lauding GOPers (while they are on hate radio tearing him apart) and lauding Gipper, but is he trying to give the GOP enough rope to hang themselves? Maybe or maybe not. This is the toxic political climate (and dysfunctional Congress aka Tea Party/GOP Downgrade) that he has to deal with. :(

Democratic/Progressive ideas are good when they are not watered down; Hopefully, he will come around to them (especially education, climate change, etc.), but we have to win back both the House (including a filibuster proof Senate). We should be focused on finding strong Democratic, Progressive candidates to run and convince people that they and their ideas can benefit our lives in the long run. IMO, some just get bogged down at the vitriol from the usual suspects that concludes that no one really has O's back when they (or some) do. Thank goodness, blogs and SN are not the real world.

Don't know if this post helps answer your question, but tried to make a little sense. :hi:

[Mass]

41. You have to promote these ideas and then you will win elections.

The GOP promoted their ideas, win or lose. People got used to them, and then they recognized them in candidate. I am all for getting true Progressive to run, but if the WH talks about conciliation with the GOP rather than saying how Democratic ideas are good, it will not help those progressives.

[politicasista]

44. Exactly. I agree with you n/t

[karynnj]

37. What elephant?

That suggests that you, at least to some degree buy the silly comments from uninformed people. Could they site one instance where Kerry sided with McCain against Obama. A careful analysis of all their joint work shows that it is all on things that Obama supports. (from their privacy work to trying to get a resolution on Libya) Point this out to these anonymous people. It greatly HELPS Obama when Kerry gets a respected Republican sponsoring things - nothing can pass with just Democrats.

Here on DU, though there are very strong Obama people, he is currently facing far more criticism than Kerry. Being President means he gets a large amount of credit for good thins and lots of blame for bad things.

[karynnj]

38. What elephant?

That suggests that you, at least to some degree buy the silly comments from uninformed people. Could they site one instance where Kerry sided with McCain against Obama. A careful analysis of all their joint work shows that it is all on things that Obama supports. (from their privacy work to trying to get a resolution on Libya) Point this out to these anonymous people. It greatly HELPS Obama when Kerry gets a respected Republican sponsoring things - nothing can pass with just Democrats.

Here on DU, though there are very strong Obama people, he is currently facing far more criticism than Kerry. Being President means he gets a large amount of credit for good thins and lots of blame for bad things.

[politicasista]

43. Not buying anything or anyone

Don't tweet (do not have an account), but lurk there and Facebook where Roger Lau and Brigid O have been doing a good job there, but that has to be frustrating for them keep doing the media's homework for the constituents, though they follow Obama daily.

Maybe Kerry/McCain being together just brings out the worst in people. (McCain is all over the place while Kerry is statesmanlike). Compromise is necessary. Not taking swipes at what the Senator has done or doing, and wish him all the best for 2014, but it would be nice if he was more respected for what he is still doing now.

Agree about Obama facing more criticism than Kerry and getting credit for the good and blame for the bad, but it is also time for the Party to call the constant disrespect that is tossed at PO on a daily basis for what it is. It is not about policy or "big guv'ment", it is about the man that is head of the government. It just wrong and that is the elephant in the room. Luckily, the Tea Party downgrade line (though it should be called the Tea Party/GOP downgrade) is a start and hopefully, more will point it out between now on next year.


Again, sorry for coming into this thread. You all got this. Peace.

[karynnj]

36. I'm with you on the fact that the majority of Democrats have more than had Obama's back

I think that many -Durbin and Kerry most of all - have often taken hits for Obama. Both are too Obama's left and both are,if anything too slow to publicly disagree with Obama.

[politicasista]

40. They have

but how many are noticing if they see that Obama is the only pol to be trusted or making sense. Just an observation.

[Mass]

42. I have no idea what you mean by this?

[politicasista]

45. Long story and hard to understand

but a reminder to stay off the social networks for a while because I have no clue about anything or agendas of people. Plus, I don't want to undermine Senators Kerry or Durbin or use PO to dump on them.

[politicasista]

30. ...

Excellent thoughts, not a fan of the deal either, but it is another example of elections having dire consequences.


Enjoy Italy. Peace. :hi:

[Mass]

33. Thanks, karynnj and YvonneCa, for these insightful analysis.\nt

[ProSense]

16. There is a wonderful

diary up at Daily Kos: It's Official: The Tea Party Downgrade.

[Inuca]

46. Just a very short 2 cents

on the MTP interviews yesterday. That Kerry was great and McCain was... mcCain is a given. But what pissed me off is why were they interviewed separately? While I was listening to McCain I kept telling myself how wonderful it would have been if Kerry was there to be able to react and answer to some of the nonsense (to put it mildly and politely) that he was spewing. Didn' Gregory want them together? I am not a fan, but he is not so as bad as not to realize that it would have made for more interesting and moew newsworthy TV. Did one of them object to being "face-to-face" with the other (if that happens to be the case, not difficult who the objector was...). I don't know.... just wondering...

[karynnj]

47. The last time I remember a joint interview was at the time Petraous

was testifying before various committees in 2007. Though the talking head tried to help McCain, Kerry ran circles around him. Note this was AFTER Kerry lost and when McCain thought he was the next President. I think he understands that he can no longer have a debate with Kerry - and have it even look like a draw. (The Start floor debates showed that.