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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:41 PM
Original message
Poll question: Who was/is the worst president?
Edited on Mon Jan-01-07 04:31 PM by uppityperson
Edited to add that the choice is not for overall worst president ever, but just between these 2.
Mr.bush the younger or Gerald Ford?

In my opinion, G.Ford was no Mr.bush. Mr.bush's crimes far outweigh G.Ford's.
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dave_p Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
1. Shock result!
I don't think you'll find much dissent on that score. :D
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Who would have EVER guessed????NT
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. From what I've read even on DU, made me wonder.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. kick
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genie_weenie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
4. All.
I am sick of the Great Man Theory and wish we could do away with the whole idea that people need to be lead.

Strong leadership is when someone whom you agree with forces those beliefs on others.
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brentspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. ?????????????????
"Strong leadership is when someone whom you agree with forces those beliefs on others."

Can you give us an example of what you mean by "strong leadership", ie. leadership which "forces those beliefs on others"?
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genie_weenie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Yes. People vote in our Republic in order
to put people into Government. Those officials then decide on laws. For example, Taxes, Gay Marriage and Polygamy.

I don't believe the Government should have the power to lay and collect taxes on income. But, Strong Leadership forced this upon the population in 1913. I don't want to pay taxes to fund the DoD and the Imperial Army/Navy we have created but taxes are forced upon me.

I believe everyone should have the ability to marry whomever they wish, others do not. People who wish Gay Marriage to not be illegal vote in leaders who will then pass laws to that effect.

Polygamy is illegal. But, not all in america agree with this, therefore it's status as illegal is being forced upon people.

Why did the Republicans want to retain control of Congress? So they could continue to force their positions upon other Americans.

Why did the Democrats want to gain control?

Government is raw naked power. In America, it has been decorated with the so-called ideals of Democracy.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Please tell me more of what you mean since I don't understand.
It seems to me that strong leadership is too subjective, as far as the word "strong" is. Yes, could be someone really nasty. To me a strong leader is someone who can find ways to show people how to live up to their greatest positive potentials, and the world also.
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genie_weenie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Was Lincoln a good president? A strong leader?
1 million Americans dead, the consitituion tattered, the idea that one can decide to stay in or leave the Union destroyed.

IMO, Government is all about being able to put someone into power who will force others to conform to your belief system. This is why the republicans wanted to retain control of Congress, so that Americans would have to abide by their decisions.

The tragedy is most hold their belief system in politics is the true and noble one, so forcing others to conform isn't actually evil.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
18. Partially true, but is forcing others to be decent to all such a bad thing?
"strong" is too subjective a word, since it could be either nasty or good. Also, forcing others to be decent people, to be humane shows me the oxymronish quality of the word "humane".
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genie_weenie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #18
25. Force/Coercion
I think forcing or fooling people to do things is probably the basis of most wrongs in the world.

However, I don't know if we can ever be free of a Body like Government in the world. That of course does not mean that Government is good but only at best grugdingly necessary.
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baldguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
5. When the GOP names an aircraft carrier after him
We should insist it be called the USS Worst President Ever

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Faygo Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
8. This one is not even close.
Heard Ford in a 1999 interview with Larry King the other night say, "Betty and I are pro-choice." Period. No hesitation, or qualifiers. Also, Ford chose to announce amnesty for "draft dodgers" before the VFW national convention! Can you possibly imagine W. even speaking before a potentially hostile audience, let alone announce a policy that audience would strongly oppose? Many examples abound. There were plenty of posts saying there are "no differences" between Ford and Bush right after Ford died. Those posts ignore the character and policies of both men in coming to that conclusion.
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TreasonousBastard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. Good thing I missed...
all the BS about Ford being anything close to Shrub. Kneejerk nonsense from freeper mentalities.

Don't remember much about Ford's policies, (except those stupid WIN buttons)but I do remember that I almost voted for him since I wasn't sure that Carter wasn't a Bible-thumping wingnut at the time. In retrospect, the general public remembrance of him as an honest man of intelligence, dignity, and honor is spot on-- as far removed from Shrub as can be.

Policies are important but the integrity of the person instituting them is equally important, if not more so.


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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
12. Every fiber of my being KNOWS
G.W. Bush is by far, the worst president America has ever had.
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mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
13. RayGun
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Honestly, I'd be relieved if Reagan rose from the dead and took over for the rest of W's term.
How is Reagan the worst?
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mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. cause his evil has gone unnoticed
Whereas Bush's evil is very well know (he was AOL villain of the year!)

RayGun destroyed the working class...destroyed our right to collective bargin...led us down an immoral foreign policy that resulted in both the DLC and the neo-con rise to power.

Please remember that GHWB was calling the shots for the mentally ill Ray-gun. This was the first push toward the NWO.
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Oleladylib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. Reagan was sly..a mediocre president and bad actor..
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-02-07 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #20
27. Okay, he was that.
He was definitely a crappy president with a smooth veneer. He was marginally lousy in all measures.

Know what?
I would take a president who was marginally lousy over one who's terminally, recklessly,
malignantly, anti-American.
:patriot:
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mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-06-07 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. RayGun did to the middle class
what w. is doing to Iraq.
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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
17. "I Miss Nixon" (My bumper sticker that says it all.)
I love imagining some freeper brain short-circuiting when reading that. :evilgrin:
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illinoisprogressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
19. As a lover of history
I have read alot about the presidents. In my opinion, Jr. is by far the worst of any president this country has ever had. No one comes close to the sum total of Jr. misdeeds, crimes and failures.
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
21. How could you not include Nixon, Reagan, or Bush Sr. in the poll?
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. because I am limiting it to the choice between these 2.
an overall "who is the worst ever" would be good, but that is for another poll. This one is just limited to these 2 since Mr.bush is here now and G.Ford just died and there is a lot of talk about them, comparing them.
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HockeyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
23. Top 3 in my lifetime
The Chimp, Nixon, Bush Senior. I would rate Ford a distant 4th.
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Faygo Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Always considered Nixon the worst, but Shrub is a catastrophe.
I read where W. is our first catastrophic president; i.e. not even able to be rated versus other presidents, but in a class by himself - the only president from which the nation and the world will not fully recover. I think that's true, in so many areas. I can't name any other presidents in the same breath with him, no matter how strongly negative I feel about them. He is in a class by himself. And look out in 2007. I fear the worst is yet to come, Dem control of Congress notwithstanding.
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HockeyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-01-07 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. I forgot about Reagan
I would probably put Ronnie somewhere around Bush Senior, maybe tied for 3rd. It was a different world under Ford, religion/social issues hadn't yet mixed into the federal political arena. I would blame Reagan for the start of that one, although both Reagan and Bush Sr. just paid lip service to these Fundies. However, they laid the foundation for what was to come.
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-02-07 04:06 AM
Response to Reply #23
28. Why would Ford be in the top 10 worst?!?
We have a long history of lame-ass presidents, such as Andrew Jackson.
Gerald Ford is a gentle lamb, in the scheme of things.
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