"Many Dead" in Somalia, but the Batman villain got away, maybe.

[Philosoraptor]

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/articlenews.aspx?type=UKNews1&storyID=2007-01-09T131450Z_01_L08690887_RTRUKOC_0_UK-SOMALIA-CONFLICT.xml&WTmodLoc=HP-C1-TopStories-2

"There are so many dead bodies and animals in the village," the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity, told Reuters.

U.S. intelligence believes Abu Talha al-Sudani, named in grand jury testimony against Osama bin Laden as a Sudanese explosives expert, is al Qaeda's east African boss and is hiding among Islamist troops fleeing Ethiopian and Somali forces.

It was not clear if he was killed in the attack, which the Pentagon declined to confirm or deny.

Mindful of a disastrous intervention in the early 1990s, related in the book and film "Black Hawk Down", Washington had until Monday not overtly involved its forces in the war.

[bdamomma]

1. OMG

[butterfly77]

31. Where's Osama?

[babylonsister]

2. Another well-thought out plan-NOT. This is getting even more

sickening.

[Philosoraptor]

4. So we're at war in Africa now too?

I can't keep up.

[peace13]

3. When * gets tired of traveling to kill

he will use this method on us. He is one sick dude!

[Philosoraptor]

5. w's terrible swift sword, his truth is marching on, glory glory hallelujah

[atreides1]

11. Probably

And the military will follow his orders without question, just like they do now.

Slowly but surely the military is becoming the new Praetorian Guard for Emperor George I, but maybe
the Emperor should read some history about the original Praetorians and how they started to make
the decisions about who would be Emperor and how they implemented that decision.

[Double T]

6. What the hell gives this murderous barbarian the 'right' to kill so many innocent civilians.........

in so many foreign countries???

[Philosoraptor]

8. Apparently it was God Almighty.

Can we call them Nazi's yet? Or can we say maybe they are similar? I don't wanna be too harsh.

[Double T]

12. When 'WE' add up the dead and add in those maimed and injured.......

on all sides, bushco is right up their with the MOST heinous tyrants in history.

[AspenRose]

28. Not the God I worship....this is sickening

I heard this on BBC this morning and thought, "may God have mercy on us all."

We (as a country) are going to reap the whirlwind, big time. :scared:

This man who calls himself our 'president' needs to be stopped, NOW.

[geomon666]

7. So we had to bomb the whole village to get one guy?

Jesus, this is worst than the Columbian drug lords that would execute whole families just because they were in the house.

[Philosoraptor]

9. Yeah, he might have been there, & we may have killed him.

Is what I gather. I strongly suggest to everyone not to walk around looking like you may be in Al Qaeda, or appear to be a terrorist enemy in disguise.

[Bigmack]

10. I posted on another thread....

These stories have a predictable trajectory....

Same event.... with an unfolding outcome.

First day "40 terrorists killed by precision bomb"

Second day "20 terrorists killed by precision bombing"

Third day "4 probable terrorists and 18 civilians killed by bomb"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=3072977&mesg_id=3073164

Add: The bad guy got away....

[Warpy]

13. We don't even know if a villain was ever there

because the information came from the local warlords. It's not like that poor country has ever had much of a reliable government.

It might have been some poor slob who was late with the baksheesh and we managed to kill his whole family, along with all his livestock.

[hatrack]

22. Local warlords would never plant information to get rid of an enemy, would they?

Thank God we only killed "bad guys" and that the intelligence was 100% reliable!

:eyes:

[Zodiak]

25. That is exactly what I was thinking

Who is to trust these guys' "intelligence".

[TahitiNut]

14. If this was a platoon of Marines that attacked and killed EXACTLY the same people

... , exposing themselves personally to close combat, they'd be on trial for murder. The 'moral relativism' of combat is an abomination to a sane mind.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

17. I have never been able to figure out how Calley was a mass murderer

and the guys who dropped napalm and high explosives on villages and population centers were "heroes".

[TahitiNut]

21. When an area was designated a "free fire zone," the dice were cast.

I have some profound objections to making grunts the fall-guys for the crimes of the command chain. The 'Nuremberg Principles' should only apply once the command leadership is convicted and not until, imho.

[originalpckelly]

15. This such a stupid way to go after al-Qaeda...

first of all, the AC-130 is not a quiet aircraft. Not by a long shot. I've heard it before, and it's a fucking awful sounding big prop looking thing.

What we need is some totally silent way to secretly track these guys, facially identify them, maybe even on the fly genetically identify them, and then with some type of super lethal poison, kill the bastards with some type of low density bullet or a poison dart.

Sounds James Bondish, but that's possible with micro UAVs and mini blimps. A relatively transparent nylon blimp could fly a number of micro UAVs into an area over long distances, then it could deploy the smaller UAVs. They would have to be solar/battery powered, and have medium sized low RPM low noise props.

This type of idea is a hell of a lot better than using big hulking planes. It's the only way we can conduct assassinations, which we should really only do in cases where someone is particularly capable of doing some type of violence.

[Philosoraptor]

16. Yeah, just look at the stealthy thing.

Snuck right up on em and they didn't even see it comin'.

[TahitiNut]

19. Spooky can be damned near silent in a tactical approach.

It has a LOT of lift and the power range is extreme. Spooky can 'coast' in for miles without making much engine noise at all. At the same time, it has an enormous amount of power to evade ground fire and maneuver over a target area.

I'm no pilot, but Spooky helped save my bacon back in 1969 - please, do some homework.

[libnnc]

24. When I was in high school

I saw one. We lived in an area in western NC where apparently there were lots of training flight patterns and we saw military aircraft all the time (from Cherry Point I guess). Anyway, I was at marching band practice, our HS was on top of a small mountain looking down over the highway. We were doing warm-ups and I looked over to my right and saw Spooky rise from just over treetop level. He must have been flying at about 500 feet off of the ground. It was the biggest aircraft I'd ever seen. Came out of NOWHERE. Scared the shit out of us. That image I'll never forget. :scared:

[TahitiNut]

27. The C-130 Hercules airframe has enormous lift capability.

Over the years, lighter materials and higher power/weight engines have only increased its ability to "loiter" over the target with minimal power. What makes it the most formidable weapon system in our arsenal is only amplified in assymetrical combat.

When something that BIG appears above you at low level, it's absolutely stunning. If full power is then applied to all four 4,300 hp engines, the roar can cause pants to get loaded.

[Norquist Nemesis]

20. Agree completely! Africa, especially eastern Africa has been

a hotspot that's been on the watch for cultivating and increasing terrorists ranks for a while now. But, it goes under the radar of the average American. I saw a piece recently that said Islam is the fastest growning religion in Africa. That doesn't bother me. What's bothersome is we go in splaying bombs on innocents giving al Qaeda a perfect propaganda opportunity.

This would have been an ideal situation for special forces. If we had the intel that they were there, then why could not have dropped in a team?

Collateral damage has collateral consequences.

[porphyrian]

18. That's the only kind of attention this administration gives to brown people. - n/t

[TZ]

23. maybe its not a bad idea but bad execution

I hate Bush as much as anybody but I hate the Taliban too and they were establishing themselves in Somalia in the last few months. Does anybody really think that Ethiopia is that much superior an army that they could kick out the Extremists by themselves? I bet the Ethiopians were either armed or supplied with intelligence by us. I can't say its a bad idea to stop another potential terrorist training ground (which was happening). It's just now becomming public. We have probably been in Somalia and Ethiopia on a covert basis for a while. Unfortunately this group tends not to execute things competently so thats my worry here.

[Zodiak]

26. Do you mean the Taliban or Al Queda?

They are two different organizations.

[newyawker99]

29. Hi turtlesue!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[CJCRANE]

30. My guess is that's just for effect.

Remember when they bombed the Pakistani village claiming they were after al-Zawahiri? (Might've been before the '04 election).

Turned out Zawahiri wasn't there and it was mainly women, children and cattle. The Pakistani govt asked them not to do it again and that was the last we heard of going after Zawashiri. My guess is the same will happen with this incident.