BUSH: "And we need to promote MATERNITY GROUP HOMES"

[Bluebear]

The pieces are all coming into fit....



"These are reasonable ways to help promote a culture of life in America. I think it is a worthy goal in America to have every child protected by law and welcomed in life.

I also think we ought to continue to have good adoption law as an alternative to abortion.

And we need to promote maternity group homes, which my administration has done.

Culture of life is really important for a country to have if it's going to be a hospitable society."
--George W. Bush, October 8, 2004 in a debate with Democratic candidate John Kerry
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/debatereferee/debate_1008.html


======
(CBS) Someone once said the only thing really new in the world is the history we don't know. The Irish people are learning that right now and it's a painful experience.

It began five years ago when an order of nuns in Dublin sold off part of its convent to real estate developers. On that property were the remains of 133 women buried in unmarked graves, and buried with them was a scandal.

As it turns out, the women had been virtual prisoners, confined by the Catholic Church behind convent walls for perceived sins of the flesh, and sentenced to a life of servitude in something called the Magdalene laundries.

It sounds medieval, something that happened hundreds of years ago, but, in fact, the last Magdalene laundry closed just over two years ago. And as the story was firstly reported in 1999, revelations have shocked the Irish people, embarrassed the Catholic Church and tarnished the country's image.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/08/08/sunday/main567365.shtml
=======
Operation Rescue Renews Call on Justice Stevens to Retire for the Good of the Children
South Dakota Abortion Ban Deserves Best Climate for Success

WASHINGTON, Mar. 7 /Christian Wire Service/ -- In anticipation of the expected court challenge to the new South Dakota law banning abortion, Operation Rescue renews its call on U.S. Supreme Court Justice John Paul Stevens to retire so that President Bush may appoint his successor.

“We are confident that the new abortion ban will pass Constitutional muster because it provides Constitutional protection for women and children,” said Operation Rescue President Troy Newman. “Even with the current composition of the court, we believe this law will stand, however, we would like to have the best possible climate for a hearing.”

“We believe that the Supreme Court will find that this law plugs the ‘Blackmun Hole’ and will stop abortion in all fifty states,” he said. “New advances in fetology have given us information on the humanity of the pre-born that did not exist when Roe was decided.”

The Blackmun Hole is a loophole where Justice Harry Blackmun acknowledged in the majority opinion for Roe v. Wade in 1973 that if it could be established that the fetus is a ‘person’ within the language and meaning of the Fourteenth Amendment, a right to abortion would not exist. He stated, “If this suggestion of personhood is established, the appellant’s case, of course, collapses, for the fetus’ right to life would then be guaranteed specifically by the Amendment.”

“Justice Stevens has served many long years on the court. We think it would be for the good of the nation if he moved on to enjoy his retirement and make way for the new court that would be certain to restore the legal protections of personhood to the pre-born,” said Newman.

http://www.earnedmedia.org/or0307.htm


Magdalene Laundries
by Joni Mitchell

I was an unmarried girl,
I'd just turned twenty-seven
when they sent me to the Sisters
for the way men looked at me.
Branded as a Jezebel,
I knew I was not bound for heaven.
I'd be cast in shame
into the Magdalene laundries.

Most girls come here pregnant...
some by their own fathers!
Bridget got that belly
by her parish priest.
We're trying to get things white as snow,
all of us woe-begotten-daughters,
in the streaming stains
of the Magdalene laundries.

Prostitutes and destitutes
and temptresses like me.
Fallen women,
sentenced into dreamless drudgery ...
Why do they call this heartless place
Our Lady of Charity?
Oh charity!

These bloodless brides of Jesus...
if they had just once glimpsed their groom,
then they'd know, and they'd drop the stones
concealed behind their rosaries.
They wilt the grass they walk upon,
they leech the light out of a room.
They'd like to drive us down the drain
At the Magdalene laundries

Peg O'Connell died today.
She was a cheeky girl,
a flirt.
They just stuffed her in a hole!
Surely to God you'd think at least some bells should ring!!
One day I'm going to die here too
and they'll plant me in the dirt
like some lame bulb
that never blooms come any spring....
Not any spring....
No, not any spring....
Not any spring.

[Random_Australian]

1. I'm wordless. It just makes you sit and think.

..............................................



.......................................................
K&R and I'll be back later when words have found me again.

Beautiful poem by the bye.

[Random_Australian]

2. Blackmun hole...WTF?

The RW nuts aresurely going to use that as justification, and once Limbaugh uses it, the dittoheads will send it everywhere.... Hey DU! We really could use a database of anti-dittohead remarks... pre-emptive as well as present? Wait a mo'... I might start a poll on that....

AAAAAAAAAAGH! Can't post polls (Not a donor, and no, my Savings Account isn't compatible for that kind of thing... and I'm not 18 yet but when I am I shall get a card and donate)

Could someone start a poll: Should DU start a database of effective anti-freeper arguments...

(we may not convince the freeper, but if it's at work etc. it's important for recruitment to win as many arguments as possible... reduce the idle people 1 at a time!)

Once again though... that poem is wonderful. Really touched something in the old heart-box.

[CornField]

28. Psssst

They've already done so --- Connor's Bill (Laci Peterson) established a fetus as a person entitled to protection under the law.

[undergroundpanther]

3. We need

To tear the heart out of the christian fascists doing this shit..We need to become so angry,relentless and in their faces they fear us..and when these thugs fear they have no hope of controlling us.

How I wish I could become Sekhmet crush them all under my feet and dance upon their broken backs as they bleed.And forever destroy the evil soul of their sickening "religion" forever that holds so many innocents, defiant ones, and abused in chains of lies and domination caused by a book of dreams ,propaganda and two faced poison for human souls written by hateful crazy zealot fanatics in the desert 2000 years ago.

[Random_Australian]

4. Whoah man... settle... (in a little while)

For a more permanent victory, I suggest the Ghandi version not the Sekhmet.

Yes I know it's almost a cliché but, hell, it works.

But for the next little while, go ahead and be REALLY PISSED...

[undergroundpanther]

8. Ghandi worked

Because there were fighters willing to do what Ghandi could not do.
Yes In India during Ghandi's peaceful revolution there was a violent revolution too.

In reality...
A wife beater will beat his wife regardless,She who does not raise her fist and smash his face in- He beats her to death.It happens too often to count.
But if you crack the fucker hard upside the head he will not try to harm again. These fuckers are bullies abusers and they haveno shame..They want to dominate and they will destroy liveds to feel like a "man" They are not rational or sane,they are like rabid dogs or a wife beating drunk.

I say use Sekhmet and Ghandi together.

Like MLK and The Black Panthers,It took shame and threat of violence and sometimes actual violence to get civil rights.That is reality.

If peace does not work and shame does not stop them you need to call down the eye of wrath.The thugs will insist on it.

[Maru Kitteh]

23. As a Christian I would NEVER do this; and condemn anyone who does

Openly whenever possible as a matter of fact. So to be straight, I just want to know, are you saying that you would dance on my broken back while I bleed? Your post seems a wee bit, well, EXTREMELY BIGOTED to me. I'm sorry about whatever happened to you but I didn't do it.

[truth2power]

33. Are you including yourself in with the Christian Fascists?

My reading of undergroundpanther's post is that the "them" referred to ("crush them") are the Christofascists. There are many good Christians who live their faith. Sadly, this does not include the current bunch of extremist fanatics, who do not know the real Jesus, and who are driving this country over a cliff. In that vein, I don't think her/his post is bigoted. BTW, I don't identify myself as a Christian, so in some sense I don't have a dog in this fight.

Some years ago, (7 or 8+ maybe?), when the Christofascists were beginning to flex their muscles, I went to an all-day workshop of sorts dealing with the so-called religious right. At one point we broke into small groups and I stated, during the discussion, that the extreme RW was "dangerous".

One woman took issue with that, saying, "Let's not demonize them." Ah, yes...lets not. I often wonder what that woman thinks now, about how dangerous they are.

There is a difference between showing tolerance and colluding in your own destruction. *sigh*

[FreedomAngel82]

54. I'm a Christian and I know who you all are talking about and

they piss me off too. I can't stand what they're doing to us women and treating us like trash. :mad:

[Tigress DEM]

29. We NEED to take back OUR Country and re-estab. rule of law-sep Church/ST

Don't know what Sekhmet is, but I get the tearing someone's heart out that is crushing you underfoot. The anger is understandable, even the automatic reaction to do violence is something that is felt and when we see injustice of such purportion still within the realm of, "OK, I hear what yo are saying, but...." And it's a heavy butt, to get to the point of violence before we have exhausted the other options would still be wrong.

We DO need to harness our anger and overcome our fear and stand together as WE THE PEOPLE, but if we let their barbarism dictate our behavior, we lose.

Remember just because someone says "Jesus" as they beat you doesn't mean that anything He said or did condoned it. Religion can be used as a tool of justification, just like kids skipping out on work can say they are going to the "library" when it's actually a party where the only studies going on are of one another's anatomy.

April 29 - stand up wherever you are and join the protests near your state capitals. They are scrambling even though they are still in power to do as much damage as they can before they are ejected.

[FreedomAngel82]

55. Even Jesus said that

"Not everyone who says 'Lord Lord' will get into the Kingdom of Heaven."

[Peter Frank]

5. If Bush is so pro-life...

...why did he unnecessarily kill & maim so many babies in Iraq?

[Bluebear]

6. They were already born. nt

[adriennui]

7. bush isn't pro life

he's pro fetus.

[davekriss]

74. He isn't even pro-fetus, he's just opportunistic (eom)

[undergroundpanther]

9. Non violence does nothing to stop abusers

Ghandi had to admit he was wrong and if he was wrong his philosophy was flawed.

If the capacity for non-violent self-defense is lacking, there need be no hesitation in using violent means.
--Gandhi, GONV, p. 38. (I-260.)
Again, interesting. But to be really sensible, it should be rephrased: If the actual possibility for non-violent self-defense is lacking, there need be no hesitation in using violent means. And "self-defense" itself must be construed broadly here; it is not only one's personal defense which is at issue, but that of the people generally. And it is not only at moments when the enemy is actually shooting at you when this applies, but also when they are loading their weapons.


I have admitted my mistake. I thought our struggle was based on non-violence, whereas in reality it was no more than passive resistance, which essentially is a weapon of the weak. It leads naturally to armed resistance whenever possible.
--Gandhi, GONV, p. 75. (II-276.)

My fast should not be considered a political move in any sense of the term. It is obedience to the peremptory call of conscience and duty. It comes out of felt agony.
--Gandhi, GONV, p. 76. (II-363.)
Gandhi did not die from his fast, but was instead murdered by one of his Hindu co-religionists. As the article on Pacifism and Nonviolent Movements in the Encyclopaedia Britannica states, the achievement of Indian independence in 1947 "was not exclusively nor even predominantly produced by nonviolent actions". <15th ed., Vol. 13, p. 850.>

Read more...about why non violence does not grant civil rights from Strong powers that abuse power and cocerce.

http://members.aol.com/ScottH9999/essays/Gandhi.htm

[Hubert Flottz]

10. Lebensborn...

snip

The Benefits of Lebensborn

Single or married, most mothers enjoyed many benefits in becoming incubators of the third Reich: it was promoted as civic duty, and married couples were often given tax and loan incentives to produce as many children as possible. Since Lebensborn was to be an experiment in creating the purest aryan bloodlines possible and pushing the threshold of the oncoming Reich or 1000 year rule, when young girls were recruited, they were promised many benefits, including all medical expenses paid. It has been described in a documentary as an "open secret" among the SS, and Hitler is known to have made mention of it---and the SS seen a premiere bloodline was ordered by Himmler to set a goal for 4 or more children. 1 Illegitimacy even then in Germany still bore the mark of stigma, so discretion was used and afterwards, most of the young women gave up their infants, often in a pre-agreement: the children at birth were given in priority first to SS couples and secondly to prototype Aryan families that both nature and nuture criteria would be fulfilled. Mothers were bound by contracts to the German State to place the children into foster care. Programs were also set up in Norway, with the Norwegian government in cooperation. Norwegian women were considered acceptable for their aryan features.

http://www.shoaheducation.com/lebensborn.html

Is there anything Bush don't want to tinker with? The man is crazy as a bed bug!

EDIT...

The Eugenics Movement in America

http://www.shoaheducation.com/pNEW.html

Race Hygiene: Three Bush Family Alliances

snip...

Bush and Draper
Twenty years before he was U.S. President, George Bush brought two `` race-science '' professors in front of the Republican Task Force on Earth Resources and Population. As chairman of the Task Force, then-Congressman Bush invited Professors William Shockley and Arthur Jensen to explain to the committee how allegedly runaway birth-rates for African-Americans were `` down-breeding '' the American population.

Afterwards Bush personally summed up for the Congress the testimony his black-inferiority advocates had given to the Task Force. George Bush held his hearings on the threat posed by black babies on August 5, 1969, while much of the world was in a better frame of mind--celebrating mankind's progress from the first moon landing 16 days earlier. Bush's obsessive thinking on this subject was guided by his family's friend, Gen. William H. Draper, Jr., the founder and chairman of the Population Crisis Committee, and vice chairman of the Planned Parenthood Federation. Draper had long been steering U.S. public discussion about the so-called `` population bomb '' in the non-white areas of the world. MORE

snip...

Bush and Gray

Race science experimenter Dr. Claude Nash Herndon provided more details in an interview in 1990.

Alice Gray was the general supervisor of the project. She and Hanes sent out letters promoting the program to the commissioners of all 100 counties in North Carolina.... What did I do? Nothing besides riding herd on the whole thing! The social workers operated out of my office. I was at the time also director of outpatient services at North Carolina Baptist Hospital. We would see the parents and children there.... I.Q. tests were run on all the children in the Winston-Salem public school system. Only the ones who scored really low , the real bottom of the barrel, like below 70.

Did we do sterilizations on young children? Yes. This was a relatively minor operation.... It was usually not until the child was eight or ten years old. For the boys, you just make an incision and tie the tube.... We more often performed the operation on girls than with boys. Of course, you have to cut open the abdomen, but again, it is relatively minor. MORE...

http://www.tarpley.net/bush3.htm

[Bluebear]

16. Oh that could NEVER happen here!

:sarcasm:

[FreedomAngel82]

56. This is the scariest thread/post I've ever read

Holy shit. No wonder they were funding Hitler. They have the same plans. Excuse me my head just exploded.

[Hubert Flottz]

72. Yes the "New World Order" that Poppy Bush spoke of in the 90s

was the offshoot of Hitler's "World Order" or "Thousand Year Reich." The same people that were behind Hitler's rise to power fund and support Bush's "New World Order."

Go read more at the link...

snip...

Dr. Clarence Gamble, heir to the Proctor and Gamble soap fortune, was the sterilizers' national field operations chief.

The experiment worked as follows. All children enrolled in the school district of Winston-Salem, N.C., were given a special `` intelligence test. '' Those children who scored below a certain arbitrary low mark were then cut open and surgically sterilized.

We quote now from the official story of the project:


In Winston-Salem and in Orange County, North Carolina, the field committee had participated in testing projects to identify school age children who should be considered for sterilization. The project in Orange County was conducted by the University of North Carolina and was financed by a `Mr. Hanes,' a friend of Clarence Gamble and supporter of the field work project in North Carolina. The Winston-Salem project was also financed by Hanes. '' <`` Hanes '' was underwear mogul James Gordon Hanes, a trustee of Bowman Gray Medical School and treasurer of Alice Gray's group>....

The medical school had a long history of interest in eugenics and had compiled extensive histories of families carrying inheritable disease. In 1946, Dr. C. Nash Herndon ... made a statement to the press on the use of sterilization to prevent the spread of inheritable diseases....

The first step after giving the mental tests to grade school children was to interpret and make public the results. In Orange County the results indicated that three percent of the school age children were either insane or feebleminded.... the field committee hired a social worker to review each case ... and to present any cases in which sterilization was indicated to the State Eugenics Board, which under North Carolina law had the authority to order sterilization....more...

http://www.tarpley.net/bush3.htm

[smirkymonkey]

76. Beat me to it....

And people still bristle at comparisons between Bush and Hitler. Everyday they become more and more alike. Lets just hope it doesn't end the same way.

[NMMNG]

11. Maternity group homes

Where "every child (is) protected by law and welcomed in life."


And every pregnant woman is degraded, controlled, manipulated, abused and devalued.


Culture of life for whom?

[Oeditpus Rex]

12. My bio mom was basically kidnapped

and shipped off to a city 100 miles from here to wait until I was ready to come out. She was held prisoner, more or less, in a childless couple's home until April 4, 1956, when sometime that morning she gave birth to me, but wasn't allowed to see me, much less hold me.

I met her 36 years later. It was the second time in my life I'd ever really felt connected to someone. The first was my half-sister — and the fact that she was my half-sister was kept from me for years.

My mom and I got along wonderfully, I thought. But after she went back home to South Carolina we exchanged a few letters before hers just stopped coming. I guess she couldn't handle it. Can't really say I blame her.

Oh — and by California law, I'm not allowed to see any of my birth records.

Yeah — adoption is wonderful.

[NMMNG]

13. Of course

Must hide shameful secret from the world. No doubt her parents claimed she was on some religious retreat or away at "school". Such a hideous thing to do to a scared young girl.

And to think they want to bring that sort of thing back. It fills me with so much anger.

My mom had it somewhat better. When she got pregnant in 1968 she wasn't shipped off and made to hide away. She married my father, had me and kept me. They ended up divorcing a few years later and I stayed with her, but at least she wasn't treated like some pariah.

I'm sorry for what you and your mom went through. It should not be that way. :hug:

[Oeditpus Rex]

15. I forgot one part

All that was arranged through my adoptive parents' church. My middle name was the minister's name, and my mom (adoptive) loved to tell me how when I was baptized he held me and said to the congregation, "This is my namesake, folks."

I'm sure he was quite proud of himself.

[FreedomAngel82]

58. That is some scary shit

I'm sorry you and your mother had to go through that. Did you ever find out if she was forced to do everything or just kidnapped or how did it come about or what? I find all this very scary. :\ :hug:

[Oeditpus Rex]

65. She wasn't literally kidnapped

But it was against her will. She was in a deep depression, and they got her with the "You want to do what's best for your baby, don't you?" bit.

[NMMNG]

80. No doubt

Gets to stand up there and strut like a peacock about you being his namesake while failing to say how your biological mother was terrorized prior to your birth and never allowed to see you afterward. :eyes:

[FreedomAngel82]

57. Wow

Why can't you see your own records? Simply amazing. Are they hiding something or what? :shrug:

[Oeditpus Rex]

61. It's California law

Adoption records are sealed.

[liberal N proud]

14. These bastards are not pro-life, rather they are pro-birth

They care not for the woman carrying the child as they will not provide prenatal care. Nor to they care for the child or mother once it is born as they will not provide medical care for either.
They also do not wish to educate those that they force onto society.

[Maru Kitteh]

21. Well, of course it's the little harlots own fault and their wicked, wicked

flesh and sin that's brought them to those lowly circumstances so they deserve whatever they get! That'll learn em' not to enjoy sex like a NORMAL female like God intended. Just disgraceful them little jezzi-bells.

[electron_blue]

17. Don't buy into their line. It's not about "pro-life" fetus, baby, etc.

Controlling pregnant women is all about controlling the lower classes, especially their future.

All this focus on pro-choice vs. pro-life obscures the real issue.

[Samurai_Writer]

18. Here's my maternity home story

And this happened in 1978... AFTER abortions were legal. These homes are still around, btw. And even with 'open adoption' (not enforceable by law, and most of the time not really open, but semi-closed), girls and young women are coerced and manipulated into surrendering their healthy newborns for adoption.

I knew the adoption industry (and yes, it is an industry) was behind these anti-abortion bills. Their supply has severely slacked off in the last two decades, and they need to find a way to increase their supply of healthy (mostly white) newborns.

www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/2991/marybb.html


Just another birthmother, outraged at that women are still treated like incubators for better off, infertile couples.

[REP]

51. In Case You Haven't Seen These

Here are studies on the psychological sequelae of adoption on relinquishing mothers. It's not good news:

J Obstet Gynecol Neonatal Nurs. 1999 Jul-Aug;28(4):395-400.

Postadoptive reactions of the relinquishing mother: a review.

Askren HA, Bloom KC.

Deer Valley OB/GYN, Mesa, AZ, USA.

OBJECTIVE: To review the literature addressing the process of relinquishment as it relates to the birth mother. DATA SOURCES: Computerized searches in CINAHL; Article 1 st, PsycFIRST, and SocioAbs databases, using the keywords adoption and relinquishment; and ancestral bibliographies. STUDY SELECTION: Articles from indexed journals in the English language relevant to the keywords were evaluated. No studies were located before 1978. Studies that sampled only an adolescent population were excluded. Twelve studies met the inclusion criteria and were included in the analysis. DATA EXTRACTION: Data were extracted and information was organized under the following headings: grief reaction, long-term effects, efforts to resolve, and influences on the relinquishment experience. DATA SYNTHESIS: A grief reaction unique to the relinquishing mother was identified. Although this reaction consists of features characteristic of the normal grief reaction, these features persist and often lead to chronic, unresolved grief. CONCLUSIONS: The relinquishing mother is at risk for long-term physical, psychologic, and social repercussions. Although interventions have been proposed, little is known about their effectiveness in preventing or alleviating these repercussions.

Med J Aust. 1986 Feb 3;144(3):117-9.

Psychological disability in women who relinquish a baby for adoption.

Condon JT.

During 1986, approximately 2000 women in Australia are likely to relinquish a baby for adoption. A study is presented of 20 relinquishing mothers that demonstrates a very high incidence of pathological grief reactions which have failed to resolve although many years have elapsed since the relinquishment. This group had abnormally high scores for depression and psychosomatic symptoms on the Middlesex Hospital questionnaire. Factors that militate against the resolution of grief after relinquishment are discussed. Guidelines for the medical profession that are aimed at preventing psychological disability in relinquishing mothers are outlined.

Community Health Stud. 1990;14(2):180-9.

Erratum in:
• Community Health Stud 1990;14(3):314.

Social factors associated with the decision to relinquish a baby for adoption.

Najman JM, Morrison J, Keeping JD, Andersen MJ, Williams GM.

Department of Social and Preventive Medicine, University of Queensland.

Little is known about the characteristics, social circumstances and mental health of women who give a child up for adoption. This paper reports data from a longitudinal study of 8556 women interviewed initially at their first obstetrical visit. In total, 7668 proceeded to give birth to a live singleton baby, of which 64 then relinquished the baby for adoption. Relinquishing mothers were predominantly 18 years of age or younger, in the lowest family income group, single, having an unplanned and/or unwanted baby and reported that they were not living with a partner. These women were somewhat more likely to manifest symptoms of anxiety and depression both prior, and subsequent to, the adoption, but the majority of relinquishing mothers were of 'normal' mental health. The decision to relinquish a baby appears to be a consequence of an unwanted pregnancy experienced by an economically deprived single mother rather than the result of emotional or psychological/psychiatric considerations. These findings document a particular dimension of the impact of poverty on health.

My comment: young, poor pregnant women are not vending machines for the desires of wealthy infertile couples. Keep adoption safe, legal and rare.

[MountainLaurel]

78. Thank you for posting that

If I might ask, has anything changed over the past few years? The last update was from 2002.

When the Internet first became accessible at work, I did a search for my mother's maiden name just to see what came up. It's a fairly rare name, given to my great-grandfather's family at Ellis Island. Among the items I found was a letter on several adoption sites, from a woman who was looking for her half-sister. Apparently, when the woman's mother was 16, she gave birth to a daughter whom she was told was stillborn. (These were the days of twilight anesthesia and forcep births.) Only on her father's deathbed did she find out her child was alive and had been pretty much given to a baby broker. That woman died before she was able to find her child, but her daughter was continuing the search. Based on the information in the letter, I think that woman was my grandfather's first cousin. The father who gave away his grandchild and lied to his daughter was my great-grandfather's brother. I always wonder if that woman ever found her sister.

[AndyA]

19. I'm speechless.

These pro-lifers do nothing to protect the fetus other than outlawing abortion. The fact that a baby is born to people who may not want it is beside the point. The fact that there is no medical care available is also beside the point. And the fact that the unloved/unwanted child grows up to be a monster who kills people because it hasn't been loved and taught to respect life by its parents also makes no difference.

These same pro-lifers will also then take that now adult person and execute them for their sins. There's more than just a bit of irony in that.

[FloridaPat]

20. We are in a War on Terror for decades to come. The draft is

coming eventually. We need soldiers. These women have the idea that they should be able to choose. But that's a lot of cannon fodder they're aborting. This is a great idea. Group home. Group thinking. They can sign their unborn babies up for the draft in exchange for medical care.

[no_hypocrisy]

22. I knew it!! American Lebensboren!!! First they take away abortion.

Next, birth control.
Next, compulsory birth.
Next, compulsory assignment to a maternity center until birth.
Next, compulsory relinquishment of parental rights and your child is taken from you and given to a god-fearing, white fundamentalist Christian family (in the South preferably) where that child will be given the advantage of a good Christian upbringing.

[npincus]

24. "The Handmaid's Tale" by Margaret Atwood

http://www.glbtfantasy.com/?section=single&revid=219

are we there yet?

The misogynist rhetoric of the conservative minority takes on three-dimensional reality as the United States government quietly falls to a fundamentalist regime in this frightening alternate future. Our protagonist is one of the Handmaids, a group of young women who serve as breeding stock for the elite of the Republic of Gilead. If she fails to bear a child for the Commander to whom she is assigned, she will be discarded: exiled to the deadly fringes of civilized society along with the rest of the Republic's undesirables.

Like a cross between George Orwell's dystopian 1984 and Joanna Russ' dimension-hopping The Female Man, we get a multifaceted picture of how a woman might survive in a world where the "fundies" win. Its premises range from the ridiculous to the chillingly plausible, but all of it is drawn directly from the hateful rhetoric of religious and social fundamentalism, and — even scarier — historical examples of such regimes.

<snip>

A provocative, troubling commentary on the dangers of rigid fundamentalism — and the very real consequences of standing aside while zealots try to remake the world in their image. As demonstrated by the author's Historical Notes, nothing lasts forever. But then, we'd all do well to remember that that's a two-way street.

[mopinko]

39. i was just going to say that.

we are well on the way. when they throw out the
XXII amendment, you know we are there.

[katinmn]

25. It's a Baby Mill. If Bush is behind it, there's money involved.

I bet they are already pricing out babies.

[ShortnFiery]

26. Yes, where did John Roberts and his equally

INfertile bride score those lily white children? Made to order - white kids for uber-wealthy career couples - how precious - this semblance of a traditional family without all the work. :puke:

[TallahasseeGrannie]

34. Oddly enough

they got them in Latin America.

[Carni]

38. From South America

and I would like to know how the hell they found blond children in South America to adopt--how does that work?

[politicat]

52. Because the children were funneled in from Ireland.

While there are a lot of blondes in South America (there were large groups of Irish, Swiss, French, German and Dutch to emigrate to South America in the 19th century - the first head of Chile was named Bernardo O'Higgins), Time magazine published in August that Jack and Josie were born in Ireland. http://www.time.com/time/press_releases/article/0,8599,1086120,00.html

Which is interesting, because Ireland doesn't allow foreign adoptions. The mothers would have had to have traveled to some other country that allows foreign adoptions. And is more interesting because Jane Roberts has close family in Ireland and travels there often, and the Roberts were rejected by several adoption agencies in the US, including Catholic Charities. And it gets really interesting because Jane's law partner, Jack McCay, is the one who facilitated the adoption.

It's a weird situation that should have been looked into but wasn't.

[Carni]

70. I didn't know all of this

Thanks for this info--and yeah I would certainly say this should have been investigated!

What the hell?

The guy is on the highest court that structures the laws we are supposed to follow and it appears they bought a couple of black market babies--yeah this sounds about right in bushit's new Amurica.

[FreedomAngel82]

59. As anything with him

follow the money. These fundie groups give him lots of money. He works for Satan and nothing more and these people are following him to hell.

[CornField]

27. Hang on, Stevens! Stevens, hang on...

Hang on, Ginsberg! Ginsberg, hang on...

[0007]

30. This is the bending end!

I want my country back.

[AzDar]

31. Such a bastardization of the term 'Magdalene', too. Early (apocryphal)

Christian texts show that Mary Magdalene was, at the very least, an Apostle of 'Christ' in her own right, if not more...
The misogynists in the early Christian Church were so intimidated by a powerful woman (sound familiar?)that they painted her as a prostitute, and in the Canonized Texts of the Church, that is how she is remembered.
Sickening that the misogyny and fear still reign supreme...

[FreedomAngel82]

60. Exactly

And they left out a book that was written about Mary called "The Gospel of Mary." I've always felt there was more to Mary. Maybe not what the Da Vinci code says but that she was an important person. Jesus had a few women in his group and always when something important happened with his life it happened with a woman around him (see his first miracle with his mother and him showing himself to Mary first from the grave). He tried to make women be equal in society whether she was a single woman, married or a prostitute.
These people are doing everything opposite of Jesus (when do they ever follow him??) as usual.

[elehhhhna]

32. Meanwhile foster payments to grandparents who take custody are being

ABOLISHED.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

35. I work, at times, with a teen age parent program

and I think group maternity homes are a wonderful idea. However, I think the type of home I personally have in mind and the one GWB has in mind, are two very different things.

In my home, we prepare the young women for parenting, and not adoption. We pay all their expenses, make sure they get rehab if they are on drugs (have you ever taught a crack baby? Not fun.), we do job training, we nourish them, help them stay fit, intervene with medical problems, we get them ready to bring the baby home, and once THAT happens we provide free day care in a co-op that would also provide a support system. We would bring the father into the equation if possible. And we would provide free birth control. And guess what? All paid for by tax dollars. Sure it would be expensive, but 13 years of massive ESE services for damaged children is also massively expensive.

No, I don't think Bush would go for my idea at all.

Oh, and as much as I love the crazy old gals...no nuns. Really, what do nuns know about pregnancy and birth control?

[FreedomAngel82]

62. Your place sounds wonderful!

THAT is what would be great to have. Do you offer counseling too to women who are thinking of having an abortion? Sometimes all a woman needs is someone to listen and provide insight. :) I want to say thank you for all your work. What a wonderful deed you and the others there do! :hug: And I agree with you: I think Bush is thinking of something very different. If we are both wrong than I can slap myself silly.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

73. My program is in a public school

and I only work there infrequently. I'm not sure whether they do abortion counseling or not. I kind of doubt it, but they DO provide birth control services via Medicaid.

The program is on my campus but my responsibilities are in another area. But I go see the babies a lot and every once in a while I teach a class over there.

[The Icon Painter]

36. Florence Crittenton

The Florence Crittenton Homes used to be the places where all the pregnant sinners were sent to wait out their sentences. I suppose they were treated as well as they could be given the fact they were hidden from sight, relegated to the closets of distant towns, gathered in groups to contemplate the error of their ways. The babies were generally harvested and put up for adoption or farmed out into the foster care system where oversight was minimal.

The Homes were rather like very strict boarding schools with regulations for every part of life. There were governing boards formed of Junior League wannabes who took great pride in talking about how they 'took such good care' of these 'unfortunates'. It was a thoroughly sick arrangement. No, the girls/women in these places were not forced to do hard, manual labour. Perhaps worse, they were lectured and preached to without end. The psychological abuse was constant. As was the pressure not to keep the baby. After Roe, such places as this closed since 'havens' were no longer needed for the vast numbers of young women in this sort of situation. Now, it seems, we are to go back to that time and those sad, dark houses.

[Samurai_Writer]

37. Those places are still around.

Google 'Edna Gladney' for just one example.

As a former inmate of a maternity home from 1978, I could write horror stories about what went on at the Catholic Charities home I was in. And it was one of the 'best' maternity homes in the nation, supposedly.

[FreedomAngel82]

63. I think a book about those places would be a good idea

Like an essay book or something with different experiences in those places. I would buy that and I think it would be a great history lesson (those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it). And if it does happen again it could be a help manual.

[TahitiNut]

47. Yep. We had one here in the 'burbs of Detroit. I knew girls ...

... in high school who were 'disappeared' into the Crittenton Home. We all did. We'd look at the grounds as we drove by in much the same kind of foreboding as we looked at the local "Tourist Home" renowned for being a 'house of ill repute' but good reputation.

[Solly Mack]

40. I keep coming back to this thread - typing a response

and deleting. Walk away from the computer. Walk back.

I want to scream - but that won't help..and I don't really have the energy to scream. I'm too sad.

The anger's there - but few could stomach the anger I feel right now without taking it personal.
It's an all encompassing anger at every single injustice and cruelty done to women since the dawn of time. See - while some people want to tell themselves that the past is the past, women can't really afford to do that - especially since women are slapped across the face every single day with sexism and misogyny. So where some could point to improvements and feel good about doing so - I see a bunch of single baby steps forward and 12 rather harsh steps backward. Like every single "advance" comes with it's own built-in setback. There's always a catch.

[Gregorian]

41. Springtime for Hitler. BUSH WANTS TO BE GOD.

What else is there to say. I don't think even Hitler had what these assholes have. They are the grossest beings to ever walk the earth. They don't just want total power, they want that power to last into the following generations. I think I just got it- BUSH WANTS TO BE GOD.

[Wilms]

42. K&R Thanks. n/t

[Ino]

43. Prophetic dream?

About 10 years ago, I dreamed my boyfriend & I moved to Texas. My car was missing, and I told him someone must have stolen it. He said, "No, I sold it." I said, "What?! How could you sell MY car? It's in MY name!" He answered, "Women can't own property in Texas. I decided you didn't need it."

I woke up with my heart pounding, breathing hard, sweating, trying to scream. When I calmed down, I wondered where the hell that dream came from! Now I know. It was prophetic.

(Some think that a car in a dream represents your life.)

[FreedomAngel82]

64. That's really scary

I'm glad you remembered your dream. I hope it isn't though and this is all just nothing but with these people I've learned that every time you think they've done something outrageous something even more outrageous happens. :\ I'm glad for the internet so we can all have this information and we can know what's going on just in case.

[truebrit71]

44. Good grief!!

Man-oh-man....

Further proof that religious whackos of ALL denominations are dangerous, dangerous people....

[Cleita]

45. Someone should send a copy of that Joni Mitchel song

to Ed Schultz so he can play it on his program, over and over again. I think he broadcasts to S. Dakota as well. He seems to be on our side on this abortion issue.

[Bluebear]

46. Turbulent Indigo is the album

I think I will email him.

[SPKrazy]

48. Actually There Is One In My Town

and it seems to be a useful service for those who don't want to abort their baby and need help during the pregnancy.

As I understand it, they help these women transition after they leave the home, whether they give the baby up for adoption or keep it.

So, I don't think it is going to be the "handmaiden's tale" unless abortion is actually illegal. That is something that I don't see happening.

There isn't popular support for it. It just keeps the base being fed red meat to keep teasing them with it and then blame the popular culture, the courts, whatever for the fact that abortion is still legal.

[Bluebear]

49. What does popular support matter anymore with this administration?

I mean, really.

[FreedomAngel82]

66. But what does popular support matter?

It doesn't matter anymore. They don't care what we think. Remember Terri Schavio? People wanted them to butt out but they didn't and the parents and brother whored around too. They have the power, money and influence. If someone who is funding them wants this they can blackmail Bush into doing this and he'd have to for his base. Of course now that he's in his second term and final (hopefully) I don't see why he puts up this fake Christian act anymore either and gives these people power. It really doesn't make sense to me. Maybe after the midterms it'll be over? :shrug:

[bvar22]

50. THEY (the regressive Fundies) are in for a RUDE surprise.

There is no longer a category called "Fatherless Children". DNA testing can determine paternity with absolute certainty. Most of these Fundies haven't realized yet that the Mother of an unwanted child no longer bears the burden alone. In olden days, fathers could duck responsibility, but NO LONGER. Fathers will be responsible for their actions. In some cases, for 18years of Child Support.

Paternity Courts in the Fundie states are going to get very interesting.
I may go to South Dakota and open a DNA Paternity Testing Business.

Cheers!

[donkeyotay]

75. We really need to get to work on the Sperm Accountability Act

Maybe homes for wayward sperm donors. Men who irresponsibly impregnate must be held accountable. I don't want to raise their children. Make them do it.

[FreedomAngel82]

53. Very scary

I wonder if he even knows what he's talking about.

[rodeodance]

67. gawd---so this is his 'solution" to the new anti-abortion laws. Retro!

[bliss_eternal]

68. All I can say about this--

Fuck him. Fuck his ignorant, regressive, repressive ideas--fuck him in his fuckin' ear! They will have to drag me kicking and screaming and fighting the entire way, back to 1950--sorry but I won't go. I refuse!

I will NOT go back to the time (before I was born) where an unmarried woman becoming pregnant was a thing of shame, and she was sent to those horrible places to be treated like absolute shit.

Fuck him, fuck him, fuck him.

:grr::mad::grr:

[rodeodance]

69. the Irish story is so so so horrible.

[Skidmore]

71. I thought we had seen the last of these 30 years ago.

Boy, are we screaming downhill fast.

[Cats Against Frist]

77. Oh COME ON

There are different kinds of maternity group homes. I am, of course, not going to lobby for a Cathlo-fascist one, but I worked for a public one, in the state of Washington, and it was a good place that helped a lot of girls. They were as about as much of a prisoner as Paris Hilton.

Edit: BTW, the home's official position on abortion was "we can't tell you what to do." But, if the girl decided to have one, part of the job description of the staff was to help the girls get appointments and get to them, abortion included.

[Bluebear]

81. And you trust George W. Bush to provide such a nurturing, helpful home?

The deal is, see, abortion will be illegal, heh heh heh.

[mnhtnbb]

79. Movie: The Magdalene Sisters

Some of the stills posted above are from the movie. It's excellent.
Get it on DVD: http://www.miramax.com/the_magdalene_sisters/

[Initech]

82. And the theocratic drum keeps banging on...

:scared: