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The single regulation that would solve all mine safety issues

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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 10:56 AM
Original message
The single regulation that would solve all mine safety issues
"No mine may operate unless at least one company officer or member of the board is present IN THE MINE AT ALL TIMES."
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DrDan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
1. that is pretty radical . . .
good idea, though. Until there comes a company officer whom the company wishes to shed.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. You could require that each and every officer spend an equal amount of time in the mine.
That might do it.
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protocol rv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:00 AM
Response to Original message
2. Or one of his children will do
Or grandchildren.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. That assumes they love their children more than they love profit
Not sure we've seen evidence of that...
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:05 AM
Response to Original message
5. I like it!
I'm sure that they would find some way to circumvent it, though...

The whole situation just really pisses me off.

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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Let's send this idea to Alan Grayson and let him bulletproof it.
I'm pretty sure he'll find a way to make this an ironclad rule.
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Ozymanithrax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
7. Sure, he will have an office 1 foot inside the mine,
What makes mines safer are more people who inspect, penalties that actually hurt companies, and closure of mines that do not meet safty regulations until the mines are brought in spec, and require the companies to pay miners full pay and benefits while the mine is closed for repairs.

These companies want to make a profit. They can hire some idiot to stand inside the mine and die for the company. They will make some idiot President in charge of Profit Safety and set his desk on a stick of dynamite. You have to threaten them where it counts, where it hurts, and that is the pocket books of their owners and investors.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. Require them to directly supervise mining operations
Require that each executive spend at least X days per year directly supervising mining operations.
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Ozymanithrax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. These executives know that most of them will never see a problem.
Though accidents may be common, mine disasters are not. Many of the executives would be a danger to themselves and the people around them because they work behind a desk.

Companies can pay executives to take more risk. But if you threaten the companies profits, that makes them act.

You are talking about people who judge 3% higher profits better than 20 dead miners. They say, there is a 15% chance of a mine collapse per year at a certain level of risk. If they just up the chance to 20% they can make more money, and every year over five that the mine doesn't collapse is money. If the mine collapses, they estimate how long it will be out of production, and decide what level of risk to their profits is appropriate.

The only risk these companies care about is to their profits. The lives of individuals, and even managers is meaningless.

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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Here's what motivated this post
Blankenship has been quoted as saying how "tough" the West Virginian miners are and how they'll be just fine and rebound from this disaster. The main motivation for this regulation would be to embarrass Massey executives and call their own ... er ... toughness into question.

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jmowreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #9
27. That assumes they know anything about mining
There is no law whatsoever requiring a mining company--or any other company, for that matter--to be led by someone who knows anything about the industry.

If they brought in a guy who ran a corn flake plant for 30 years to run the mine because business knowledge is business knowledge and there's absolutely no difference between gold flakes and golden flakes of corn as far as pushing employees is concerned, that guy would be totally useless in a mine.

Do you really want to improve mine safety? Require the CEO of every mining company to have at least ten years' experience as a miner.
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oldlib Donating Member (549 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
8. Excellent!
The poster has a good idea to keep mine management honest.
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Dogmudgeon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:49 AM
Response to Original message
11. OUTSTANDING suggestion!
If I could make one small addition: specify that the officer or board member serve his/her shift in close proximity to the deepest-working crew.

"No mine may operate unless at least one company officer or member of the board is present IN THE MINE AT ALL TIMES and in close proximity to the deepest-working crew."

K & R to The greatest!

--d!
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YankeyMCC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:53 AM
Response to Original message
13. Or maybe that all mines (and all dangerous industries) Must
be owned and operated as a co-operative of the workers.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. NOW you're speaking my language
But... why stop at mines? :evilgrin:
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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. I mentioned this the other day... it's a great idea
I'd like to see the families win a lawsuit and take over the company.
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lame54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
15. A modern canary in the coalmine
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lame54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 12:01 PM
Response to Original message
16. We can do the same with oil execs and the military
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ihavenobias Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 02:27 PM
Response to Original message
17. Ha, ha...
Can you imagine?
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. What I can imagine is Alan Grayson introducing some new legislation
Doesn't this idea seem like a Grayson Special?

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ihavenobias Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. Yes.
If anyone would do it, he would.
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customerserviceguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-10-10 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
19. So
they create an "officer" position that pays ten bucks an hour to sit on one's ass in the mine. Won't even be a union position, since it has to be a "management" job. It won't really change anything, other than to piss off union workers who have to watch someone in a white shirt and a tie do jack shit like everybody in the real office.
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Old Troop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
21. Hold On There!
Can you imagine what it costs to clean a $3,000 suit?
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. Black Lapel Disease?
:hide:
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4lbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
24. No, just allow them to unionize. Support EFCA too.
Edited on Sun Apr-11-10 05:52 PM by 4lbs
All the mine 'accidents' the last 4 years have been in non-union mines.

Non-union mines that have hundreds, if not thousands, of safety violations and aren't held accountable to get them fixed.

A union would hold the mine owners responsible to remedy those violations before they'd allow their workers inside.

When is the last time a unionized mine had such a devastating incident?

Allowing the workers to be co-owners and thus, also be told of the safety violations, works too.
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jmowreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. 1974
The Sunshine Mine Fire in Idaho killed more miners, and it was a union-run operation.

Since then, the United Mine Workers has really gotten its shit together.
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4lbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Yes. I'll take an accident at a union mine every 35 to 40 years over the once-a-year incidents
at non-union mines.
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hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 06:46 PM
Response to Original message
25. I'd ban coal mining.
We could start by confiscating unsafe mines and hiring the workers at increased salary and much better working conditions to shut the mines down and reclaim the land.

There's no reason to burn coal. It's a primitive filthy business that should have been driven to extinction in the last century.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Works for me.
First you'll have to convince Our President that there's no such thing as "clean coal".
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Catshrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-11-10 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
28. The mine operator will be charged with murder if a mine caves in
or there are other safety violations that lead to the death of miners. After all, corporations are people now.
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